Dәriger payda әkelmese de, ziyanyn keltirmeui tiyis. Kóne grek oi­shyly Gippokrattyng naqylyn býgin kez kelgen emhananyng man­dayshasyna ilip qoygha bolady. Dәrigerlik etika, kadr әzirleu men medisina salasyndaghy bәsekelestik jayynda «Ayqyn» gazeti sau­aldaryna «Jasay» Shyghys-tiybet medisinalyq ortalyghynyng diy­rektory, medisina ghylymdarynyng doktory, professor Jasan Ze­keyúly jauap beredi.

- Eshqanday arnauly bilimi bol­masa da, nauqasty dertinen aiyq­tyrghan emshiler bolghan. Al me­disinalyq bilimi bola túra syr­qatqa qol úshyn bere al­may­tyn mamandar bar. Sonda dәriger de­gen kim? Barlyq joghary bi­lim­di medisina qyzmetkerlerin dә­riger qataryna jatqyza ala­myz ba?
- Álemde dәriger dәrejesi tek ýsh-tórt ghasyr búryn ghana be­rile bastady. Medisina boyyn­sha joghary bilimin tolyq alyp, ony toqyp, ýsh jyl boyy ba­qylau kezeninen ótken ma­man­gha ghana dәriger qújaty beriledi. Al tabighy birer qasiyetin búldap, su býrkip, em-dom ja­say­tyn­dar­dy týgeldey dәriger dey al­may­myz. Adamdardyng sýiegi shyqqan je­rin ornyna keltiretinderdi ha­lyq arasynda «otashy» dese, ha­lyq emin paydalanyp, el-júrt, auyl kóleminde nauqas­tar­dy emdeytin jandardy «emshi­ler» dep ataydy. Qytayda auyl ishin­de elge kómek kórsetetin «ja­lanayaq dәrigerler» deytinder bol­ghan. Al olardyng bәrin bir úghy­mgha toghytyp, «dәriger» dep atau­gha kelmeydi.

Dәriger payda әkelmese de, ziyanyn keltirmeui tiyis. Kóne grek oi­shyly Gippokrattyng naqylyn býgin kez kelgen emhananyng man­dayshasyna ilip qoygha bolady. Dәrigerlik etika, kadr әzirleu men medisina salasyndaghy bәsekelestik jayynda «Ayqyn» gazeti sau­aldaryna «Jasay» Shyghys-tiybet medisinalyq ortalyghynyng diy­rektory, medisina ghylymdarynyng doktory, professor Jasan Ze­keyúly jauap beredi.

- Eshqanday arnauly bilimi bol­masa da, nauqasty dertinen aiyq­tyrghan emshiler bolghan. Al me­disinalyq bilimi bola túra syr­qatqa qol úshyn bere al­may­tyn mamandar bar. Sonda dәriger de­gen kim? Barlyq joghary bi­lim­di medisina qyzmetkerlerin dә­riger qataryna jatqyza ala­myz ba?
- Álemde dәriger dәrejesi tek ýsh-tórt ghasyr búryn ghana be­rile bastady. Medisina boyyn­sha joghary bilimin tolyq alyp, ony toqyp, ýsh jyl boyy ba­qylau kezeninen ótken ma­man­gha ghana dәriger qújaty beriledi. Al tabighy birer qasiyetin búldap, su býrkip, em-dom ja­say­tyn­dar­dy týgeldey dәriger dey al­may­myz. Adamdardyng sýiegi shyqqan je­rin ornyna keltiretinderdi ha­lyq arasynda «otashy» dese, ha­lyq emin paydalanyp, el-júrt, auyl kóleminde nauqas­tar­dy emdeytin jandardy «emshi­ler» dep ataydy. Qytayda auyl ishin­de elge kómek kórsetetin «ja­lanayaq dәrigerler» deytinder bol­ghan. Al olardyng bәrin bir úghy­mgha toghytyp, «dәriger» dep atau­gha kelmeydi.
- Bes jyl bilim alyp, arnau­­ly tәjiriybeden ótse de, aldyna kel­gen nauqaspen dúrys sói­les­pey, onyng betine de qaramastan, dә­ri jazyp, qútyla salatyn «aq halattylar» kóp qoy?! Olardy da dәriger dep ataymyz ba?
- Onday adamdardy halyq dә­ri­ger retinde moyyndamaydy. Olar kәsibining rahatyn kórip, óz sa­­lasynda biyik dәrejege jete al­maydy. Dәrigerler ýshin ómir­lik әri kәsiby bilim jinaqtaytyn oryn auyl dep sanaymyn. Mә­se­len, «100 mektep, 100 auruhana» bagh­­darlamasy boyynsha salynghan em­hanalarda júmys isteytin ma­man­darymyz jetkilikti me? Eger me­disina uniyversiytetin jana tә­mam­daghan jastardy auylgha ji­be­rip otyrsa, olar halyqtyng ishinde ósip, ysylyp shyghar edi. Aurudyng bar azabyn nauqaspen birge tar­ta­dy. Al birneshe jyldan keyin qa­la­gha kelgende ol syrqat jan­dar­men mýldem basqasha sóilesetin bo­lady.
«Bir qaryn maydy bir qúmalaq shi­ri­tedi». Basyn qaghazdan almay, sot­tyng tóreshisi siyaqty otyratyn dә­rigerlerden tazaratyn uaqyt kel­di. Mysaly, bizding ortalyqqa jú­mysqa janadan kelgen dәriger ýsh ay synaqtan ótedi. Osy uaqyt ara­lyghynda nauqastardan aryz- shaghym kóbeyip, ol aurulardyng jagh­dayyn sheshe almasa, onda ony qyzmetten bosatamyz. Kóptegen el­der medisina salasynda ha­lyq­tyng ózin-ózi baqylau tә­sil­de­rin qoldanady. Mәselen, әr au­ru­ha­­nada kózge kórinetin jerde kish­kentay sandyqsha túrady. So­gh­an әrbir nauqas ózine qyzmet kór­­setken dәrigerge qatysty aryz-shaghymyn qaldyra alady. Bir aptanyng ishinde hattar jina­lyp, olardy bólim mengerushileri bas dәrigerding aldyna әkeledi. Bas dәriger aryzdargha qarap, bel­gi­li bir sharalar qoldanady. Ba­qy­lau bolmaghan jerde sapa da, dә­rigerding abyroyy da bol­may­dy.
- Jaqsy dәriger joghary oqu or­nynda әzirlenedi. Bәlkim, dәri­ger­lerdi oqytu isinde qalys qal­ghan mәseleler bar shyghar?
- Men osynda medisina un­iy­ver­siy­tetining aspiranturasynda oqy­dym. Sonda bayqaghanym: key­de negizsiz, kóp súranysqa ie emes pәn­derdi oqytyp jatady. Onday ma­mandyqtargha oqugha týsu de je­nil. Al qajetti mamandyqtardy, mә­selen, balalar syrqattary kó­beyip ketkenine qaramastan, pe­di­a­triyany qysqarttyq. Qytayda ke­risinshe, balalar dәrigerlerin әzir­leytin uniyversiytet ashuda. Ja­qynda bir jurnalister: «Egil­gen­nen ziyan shegetin sәbiyler bola ma?» dep súrady. Osynda keletin ba­la­lardyng 30-40 payyzy egiluden keyin týsedi. Óitkeni óte әlsiz, ba­synyng qan qysymy bar ba­la­nyng ata-anasyna uchaskelik dә­ri­ger kelip: «Mynau zan! Men esep be­ruim kerek. Jatqyz balany!» dep egip ketedi. Vaksina - miyk­rob­tyng qaynar kózi. Ony qa­byl­da­ghan bala sol aurumen qayta auy­ryp, ony júqtyrmaytynday bo­lady. Al vaksinany ózi әlsirep túr­ghan balagha qúighan kezde sap-sau tughan sәbiyding miyna ottegi je­tis­pey, jaghdayy odan sayyn ushy­ghyp, ayaq-qoly tartylyp, sal au­ruyna úshyraydy. Egiluden keyin osynday aurugha shaldyqqan ba­lalar osynda kelip, dertterine daua tabuda. Qytayda balanyng jagh­dayyna qarap, egudi ke­sheuil-de­tip, birneshe aidan keyin saluy mým­kin. Túmauratyp, baspamen (an­gina) auyryp túrghan balalar egil­meydi. Bizde balanyng ata-ana­sy da dәrigerding aitqanyna kónip, nau­qas sәbiyin shyryldatyp dәri­ger­ding aldyna tastay salady. Osyn­day jaghdaylarda dәrigerding eng basty qasiyetteri - imandylyghy men adamgershiligi manyzdy. Dәriger balanyng әlsiz ekenin kó­rip, oghan aldymen dәri jazyp be­rip, ony sorpalatyp, kýnge shy­gha­ryp, quattandyryp alyp, odan keyin egu kerektigin oilauy kerek. Dә­ri­gerding salghyrttyghyn biz ke­shir­sek te, Alla keshirmeydi. Dә­ri­ger - Alladan keyingi taghdyrdy she­shetin adam. Sondyqtan dә­ri­ger mamandardy dayyndau mәsele­le­rimen ainalysatyn ýlken zert­teu mektebin ashu kerek dep oi­lay­myn.
- Al elimizding medisina sala­syn damytuda qanday sala nazar­dan tysqary qalyp otyr?
- Biz kenestik jýiening shyr­mauy­nan әli tolyq shyqpay, noq­ta­syn ala almay otyrmyz. Osy sa­lany basqaryp otyrghandar - ke­nes dәuirinde tәrbiyelenip, oqy­ghan­dar. Medisina jan-jaqty da­­mysyn desek, onyng barlyq sa­la­­syn, onyng ishinde Shyghys me­diy­­sinasyn da kóterip, bәrine bә­se­­kelestik jaghday tudyru kerek. Mә­selen, Densaulyq saqtau miy­niys­trligine shyghys medisinasy kol­ledji, akademiyasyn ashu tura­ly úsynys jasadyq. Olardan: «Shy­ghys medisinasy memlekettik zan­namada kórsetilmey, oqytu jýie­sine engizilmese, ony qaytip qol­daymyz?!» degen sarynda jau­ap aldyq.
- Al el ishinde Shyghys me­diy­siy­nasy mamandaryna degen sú­ra­nys bar ma?
- Shyghys medisinasy resmy moyyn­dalmasa da, qazaqstan­dyq­tar­dyng 30 payyzy qazir Qytayda em­delude. Sol jaqtaghy emhana­lar­dyng aldyna baryp kórinizshi, qansha qazaqstandyqty kezdesti­rer ekensiz. Búl ne degen sóz? Qazaq­s­tannyng qarjysy syrtqa aghy­lyp jatyr. Onda nege sol ma­man­dardy osynda oqytyp, Europa me­disinasymen qatar shyghys em­deu tәsilderin jetildirip, zertte­mey­miz?! Memleket halyqtyng qay me­disina salasynda kóbirek em­de­lip, sauyghyp jatqanyn tara­zy­lap, sol jaghyna basym qoldau kór­setui kerek. Áytpese, tiybet me­disinasyn myqty mengergen ma­mandardyng kópshiligi múnda is­tey almaydy. Bilimi jetse de, qay­rat-kýshi sarqylyp, qaymyghyp, be­ti qaytyp, qayta eline kóship ke­tedi.
- Onday mamandar bar ma?
- Qytaydan óz qandasta­ry­myz­dyng arasynan 270 ghalym dә­ri­ger kelgen. Olardyng jetpisi qay­ta sol jaqqa ketip qaldy. Qalghany - «baraholkada» jýr. Se­bebi olar­gha júmys orny joq. Em­­ha­na­lar­gha barsa, qytay diyp­lo­myn qa­jet etpeydi. Astanagha at­tes­­ta­siya­dan ótuge bir jylgha ji­be­re­di. Al shet­ten kelgen adam jú­myssyz, qa­ra­jatsyz osynsha ua­qyt shydap túra ala ma?
Shyghys-tiybet medisina­sy - qa­zaq­tyng dәstýrli medisina­sy­nyng jalghasy. Ata-babalary­myz­dyng Otyrar kýirep qalghan kezdegi ta­rihy kitaptary, qoljazbalary Qy­taydan tabylyp jatyr. Mysa­ly, Ábu Sina, Ál-Farabiyding me­diy­­sinalyq enbekterining orny ora­­­san zor. Sol kezding ózinde so­qy­r­ishekke, baspagha ota ja­sal­­ghan. Ata-babamyz qolymyzgha tap­­syryp ketken ghylym men bilim «tis­­­tegenning auzynda, ústaghannyng qo­­­lynda» ketti. Endi búrynghyny qay­­­ta janghyrtyp, osy jýiede is­tep jatqan qazaq túlghalaryn jú­myl­­dyryp, qaytadan qazaq me­diy­siy­nasyn zerttep, oghan janasha ser­pilis beretin uaqyt kelmedi me?! IYә, keldi.
Jaqynda Qytay basylym­da­ry­nyng birinen osy eldegi densau­lyq salasyndaghy qarjylyq kiri­si­­ning 60 payyzy Shyghys-tiybet, Qy­tay halyqtyq medisinasynan tý­se­tindigin oqydym. Qytaydaghy eng әdemi әri adam eng kóp baratyn ghiy­marattar - Shyghy-tiybet me­diy­siy­­nasynyng mekemeleri. Búl em­ha­nalarda shala emshiler emes, ghy­lymy júmystaryn osy salada qor­ghaghan ghalymdar otyr. Solar eldi sauyqtyrugha ýles qosyp, mem­leketting qazynasyn tol­ty­ra­dy. Al bizde olardy shyghartpay, aram shóp siyaqty kórip, qyrqyp tas­taydy.
Qazaq óz medisinasyn da­myt­­qan kezde ghana osy salada әlem­ge ta­nylyp, abyroyy ar­ta­dy. El­basy dýniyejýzindegi eng da­myghan, bә­sekege qabiletti el­der­ding qa­ta­ry­na qosylu mindetin qoydy. Onda «әr salanyng әlem­de­gi eng ozyq ýlgilerin alyp, so­lar­dy óz je­rimizde paydalanu ke­rek emes pe?!» deydi.
- Jaqynda AQSh-ta bolyp qayt­tynyz. Búl elde Shyghys me­diy­sinasyna degen kózqaras qan­day eken?
- Bizding baghdarlamamyz búl ta­qyrypqa arnalmaghan. Biraq on­daghy qytay audanynda orna­las­qan ýlken Shyghys medisina or­talyghyn kórdim. Búl emhana basqa medisinalyq ortalyq­tar­men qatar júmys isteude. Bos­tonda 22 myng adam júmys istey­tin, 8 myng palataly em­ha­na­da bolyp qayttyq. Sonda bir tanghalghanym: emdelushiler ýl­ken itterimen kýzetshining qasy­nan jaybaraqat ótip, emhanagha emin-erkin kire beredi. Endi bireu my­­syghymen jýr. Sonda olardan: «Ýy hayuandaryn da kirgize bere­siz­der me?» dep súradym. Em­ha­na­nyng qyzmetkerleri keybir nau­qastar ýy januarlaryn kór­se, qan qysymdary tómendep, jay­baraqat kýige týsip, opera­siya­­lary jenil ótetindigin aitty. Sol ýshin nauqas aldyn ala óti­nish jazyp, iytin aldyrady eken. Em­hananyng ainalasyndaghy se­r­u­en­­deytin baq, balalar oinay­tyn arnayy alanqaydy tama­sha­la­dyq. Taghy bir qyzyghy: 22 myng ada­mnyng 7 myny ghana dәriger bol­sa, qalghandary - qyzmet kór­setu salasyndaghy basqa ma­man­dyq iyeleri. Yaghny auruhana­da­­ghy nauqastar emdelip qana qoy­may, olardyng ózderin qolay­ly sezinip, tezirek sauyghyp ketui ýshin barlyq jaghday jasalynyp qoy­ghan.
- Siz aldynghy súhbatynyzda Japo­niyada nauqastargha japon er­te­gileri aitylyp, olar japon әn-kýilerimen emdeletinin bayan­dap ediniz. AQSh emhanalarynda jer­gilikti halyqtyng ýy januar­la­ry­na degen sýiispenshiligi siyaqty erek­sheligi eskeriledi eken..
- Onynyz ras. Japoniyada pa­la­tada jatqan nauqastardyng ja­pon­dyq ýlgidegi kiyimderin kiii­ne, sakura gýlin tamashalap, ja­ponsha әn-kýiler tyndauyna da jaghday jasalynghanyn kórgen­biz.
- Qazaq medisinasynda qan­day últtyq ózgeshelikterdi pay­da­la­nugha bolady?
- Izrailide, keybir eu­ro­pa­lyq elderde jýrek, qan ta­my­r­la­ry au­rulary institutarynda, me­­­diy­­­siy­nalyq ortalyqtarynda óz­­­­de­ri­ning taza qyzyl sharaptaryn qú­­­ty­gha qúiyp, әzirlep qoyady. So­ny nau­qastyng salmaghyna qaray, onyng qanyn kóbeytu ýshin 100-200 gramnan berip otyrady. Ger­ma­niyada shúbatty ókpesi auyrghan, әlsiz, antibiotik kóp qoldanghan adam­dargha quattandyrushy dә­ru­men retinde jazady. Qymyz da so­lay paydalanylady. Bauyry au­yr­­ghan adamdargha arnap eshkining qatyghyn Italiyanyng zauyttary shygharyp jatyr. Onyng 150 gramy 600 tenge túrady. Búl tagham ba­la­lar­dyng әlsizdigine de óte paydaly. Japoniya dәri­hanala­ryn­da jyl­qy etining jýz gramy qym­bat tú­rady.
Biz she? Bos jatqan fermalarda bes jýz eshkini baghyp, sol qatyqty ne­ge ózimiz jasamaymyz? Jylqy men týie ósirip, qymyz ben shú­bat­ty dәrihanalar men em­ha­na­lar­gha nege bermeske? Men osynda ke­­letin nauqastargha jylqynyng qay­­natpa sorpasy, jylqynyng sau­maly, eshkining sýti men siyr­dyng sýti qanday nәrsege kerek eken­­digin aityp, auruyna qaray qo­­symsha jazyp beremin. Mәse­len, búryn atalarymyz jóteldi basu ýshin eshkining sýtin qaynatyp, oghan bal nemese qúiryq may qo­syp bergen.
Qazir emhanalarda botqa men borsh, bir tilim myjylghan et be­re­di. Oghan sau adamnyng da den­sau­ly­ghy shydamaydy. Jetpis jyl búrynghy «qalpaq» әli sheshilmegen tәrizdi. Odan da auruhanalarda shúbat pen qymyzdy, jylqynyng etin berip, qazaqtyng kýilerin oi­na­typ, palatalar әdemi tor­syqtar men últtyq órnek­terimizben be­zen­dirilse, keremet emes pe?! Adam quat­ty dәmning kómegimen de au­ruyn jene alady Búl bir jaghynan em­dik turizm salasyn damytyp, she­teldikterding osynda kóptep keluine jol ashady. Eger últtyq ta­ghamdar mәselesin sheshsek, qa­zaq­­targha da júmys orny kóbeyedi. Shúbat pen qymyzdy qazaq sha­r­ua­sy әkelse, bauyrsaqty qazaq әie­li jasamay ma?! Et, qúrt, irim­shik tek qazaq auyldarynan aly­na­d­y. Eshkini de qazaqtar jaqsy ba­gha­dy. Qytaydyng qyzanaq pen qiyaryn, Reseyding kolbasasyn je­gen­she ózimizding últtyq tagham­da­ry­myzdy paydalanayyq. Sol ar­qyly azyq-týlik jaghynan basqa elderge jalynyshty bol­may­myz, halyqtyng densau­lyghy da týzeledi. Al qazir balalarymyz ba­zarda arba iyterip, әjelerimiz kó­shede qayyr súrap jýr. Na­my­sy­myz qayda? Qayda ketip ba­ra­myz?
- Últtyng keleshegi úrpaqtyng densaulyghyna baylanysty ghoy. Deni sau últ boludyng tetigi nede?
- Densaulyqty nyghaytudyng eng basty joly - elimizde әr otbasy tynysh ómir sýretindey jaghday jasau. Halyqtyng әleumettik jaghdayy jaqsarmay, medisina da, qazaqtyng basqa últtar aldyndaghy abyroyy da kóterilmeydi.
Ol ýshin barlyq jerlerde dýken saludyng ornyna, óndiristi órkendetip, halyqty júmyspen qamtu isine kóp kónil bólgen jón. Mysaly, daghdarys kezinde jol baghdarlamasy qabyldanyp, qan­shama adam júmyspen qam­tyl­dy?! Qanday jaqsy! Aqshany syr­tqa shygharmay, óz ónim­de­ri­miz­di shygharyp, salyqty osynda tó­leyik. Áytpese, su betinde qal­qy­ghan japyraq tәrizdi әr iyirim ózi­ne әkete beredi. Densaulyq saq­tau boyynsha memlekettik bagh­darlamalar «auyrmay túryp em­deluge» baghyttaluy tiyis. Qo­gham­da kóbeyip ketken auru týr­le­rin (mysaly, balalardyng sal au­ruy) emdep qana qoymay, olar­dyng taralu sebebin anyqtap, zert­tep, oghan qarsy sharalar der ke­zinde qabyldanghany jón. Últ­tyq taghamdardy medisinagha en­gizu dәstýrin qalyptastyratyn ua­qyt ta keldi.
- Ótken dәrigerler mere­ke­sin­de aitylghan qanday arman-ti­le­­giniz boldy?
- Dәrigerler qyzmeti aqparat jýi­esi arqyly dәriptelip, me­diy­sina ghalymdary, qyzmet­ker­le­ri qoghamgha kóbirek tanysty­ry­lyp, tarihta bolghan qazaq dәri­gerlerining enbekteri, zert­teu­leri jinaqtalyp, qayta shy­gha­rylyp, nasihattalsa dep ar­man­­daymyn. Dәrigerlerding en­­be­gi turaly jii aitylsa, olar­gha degen halyqtyng qúrmeti de ar­typ, dәrigerler de halyqqa eki eselep ter tógedi. Reseyde «Den­saulyq» telearnasy, Qy­tay­da ýsh densaulyq te­le­ar­na­sy kór­­setiledi. Sebebi aqparat ar­­qy­­ly milliondaghan adam den­sau­­­­lyghyn týzey alady. Qazaq: «Eng basty baylyq - densaulyq» de­gen. Damyghan elderde auru adam­­dy mәdeniyetsiz dep sanaydy. Qa­zaq mәdeniyetsiz bolmauy tiyis. Bo­lashaqta Qazaqstan halqy mә­de­­niyeti damyghan elderding sa­naty­n­­da bolatynyna kәmil se­ne­min. ­

Súhbattasqan
Ayjan Kóshkenova

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